Inst@Guru: Bentinho Massaro Ep 13 - The Insane Text Messages Part 4

Inst@Guru is an investigative series examining Bentinho Massaro, a Dutch-born spiritual influencer, and the high-control dynamics inside his organization. It's built around the accounts of three former members who spent years close to him: Jacqueline Graham, Keilan McNeil, and Jade Alectra. Each brings their own texts, memories, and evidence to build a full picture of what actually happened, and why it's so hard to see from the inside while you're living it.

This is part four of the text message series. Jacqueline, Keilan, and Jade go through their private conversations with Cory, Bentinho's right hand, and with Bentinho himself, in the aftermath of leaving his organization.

Jacqueline shares her full exit conversation with Cory, the one where every doubt she raises gets reframed as a "visit" from a negative entity. Jade walks through what happened during an isolated retreat with Bentinho, Cory, and Paola, and what she describes as being groomed into treating consent as something to overcome. You'll hear what happened to Paola in the years that followed. Keilan shows the "plug the holes" damage control that kicked in within thirty minutes of a single online post, along with a threatening text from Bentinho to a former employee, and an older group chat that shows Cory's devotion to him years before any of this.

I'm Mark Vicente. I spent twelve years inside NXIVM, the group HBO covered in The Vow. This series exists because Jacqueline, Keilan, and Jade wanted people to see how this actually works from the inside, not just hear that it happened.

This is episode 13. If you haven't watched episodes 1 through 12, start there, this one builds directly on everything before it.

I also just released Narcissist's Playbook, a documentary highly relevant to this series.
https://narcissistsplaybook.uscreen.io/

Transcript

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SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hey everyone, it's been a few months since we released an Instaguru episode. Last time you heard from us, Jaclyn, Keelan, and Jade were reading their text messages. That was part three. Since then, I've been consumed with finishing Narcissus Playbook and getting it out into the world. Please go see it. It's highly relevant to this series. If this is your first episode, I'm Mark Vicente. I spent 12 years inside a group called Nixhim. We made a documentary series about it with HBO called The Vow. Basically, I know a thing or two about cults. But most importantly, if you've just stumbled on this episode of Instaguru, don't watch any further. This is episode 13. You need to go back and watch the first 12 episodes that lead up to this. It will make a lot more sense and will preempt questions like, who the hell are these people and what are they talking about? Okay, a quick refresh on some of the tactics we've been looking at since it's been a while. The psychological immune system doesn't get switched off all at once. It gets walked back in stages, each one small enough to be allowed. By the time you're deep enough in to read texts like the ones we're about to hear, the system that's supposed to warn you something is wrong has been trained to flag your own instincts as the threat. Intermittent reinforcement. Same mechanism that makes gambling addictive. You don't get punished every time you doubt. Sometimes you get punished and sometimes you get pulled in close. You never know which one is coming, so you keep pulling the lever. Is it lever or lever? I don't know. Lever lever. If you disagree with Bentinho in his world, you're not disagreeing, you're having a visit. The visit from a negative entity. Your doubt isn't information, it's an infection. And the people managing that for him aren't running an information control operation because they think they're evil. They think they're protecting him and protecting you from something dark that got into your head. That's what makes it work. Nobody in the room thinks they're the villain. Once someone leaves, the group doesn't grieve them, it manages them. There's a group chat literally called Plug the Holes. People who've left get triaged. Pull them back, neutralize them, or write them off as a defector. This episode is a long one, so here's what's coming. Jacqueline walks through her full exit conversation with Corey, the one where every doubt she raises gets turned into a visit from a negative entity. Jade reveals Cory knew Brent Wilkins was struggling before he died, and was the one who told him to go to the retreat that ended up being his last. We get into what actually happened in the pool with Jade, Corey, and Paula, and Corey admitting she never wanted anything sexual with Jade or Bentinho in the first place. You'll also hear what happened to Paula over the years that followed. And you'll see the plug the holes machinery in real time. Three different people contacted within 30 minutes of each other, right after Keelan posted something online that spooked the whole team. Bentinho's own words show up too. A text threatening a former employee for not being devoted enough, and an older group chat showing Corey's devotion to him years before any of this. This is the text messages part four. Each one of the three amigos has done each of their parts, but now there's a lot more that has been remembered, that has been discovered, and stuff that's really important. So we're going to launch into part four of the text messages, and Jacqueline's going to lead us off first and give us context for what we're about to see.

SPEAKER_05 3:54

So this is my text chat with Corey after I left. And I just want to say that sharing these texts feels really complicated for me because I at one point cared very deeply for Corey, and I still do, obviously. Um so it feels complicated to share these things, but um I think it's important to see the way that her mind is operating with like a cult program. Um yeah, this is like her her mode of operation, basically. So I had just left.

SPEAKER_06 4:31

I wanted to add one more thing. Yeah. Because we were talking about this as a concept because it it's when I zoom out and look at like, wow, we're showing text messages from these like inner workings and these deep, really hard, complicated parts of our lives. I was remembering how when I before I got in and I had been following Jocelyn, when she had come out and like put this article up, and I was like, wow, oh my God, like this guy I've been following is abusive. And I went to read it and it didn't have these details. It didn't have anything in there. It actually did the opposite and it made me push into him. So then I was like, oh my God, these bitter women. I b I bought the story before he even gave it to me. So one of the things we need to understand and make people see is that um this is like life or death for some people that get into this cult. And there are these mechanisms that are in place. And Corey is the perfect example of when you swallow every bit of what Ben is teaching, this is how your brain starts to work like his brain, and and it just becomes this machine. And so now that we've said, hey, this is bad, you need to see how bad it is, you need to see how this operates. Otherwise, someone's going to see this and it's going to do the opposite. They're gonna be like, well, it's not that bad. I can go in there. Uh what's gonna happen to me? So if I can speak to someone, if I could speak to myself five years ago and they could see this and not go and lose everything and be rebuilding for five years, and that's that's why I'm doing this. That's why we want to do this, because we want people to see how this stuff works because they don't show this part until you get too close.

SPEAKER_02 6:02

Yeah. Um, and just to hop on the train here, it's I'm gonna be sharing some text from Corey today too. And it's like the reason this is important is because it's showing how the cult works as an organism. Like Corey's to become part of the organism, and a lot of people, I feel like a a lot of cults have their kind of second in command. And when people fall out, Corey's main job is to pull them back in, and it's not even Bentino. So it's like a lot of people have been through, I think, what we've what we're gonna show today, including people that are leaving the programs now from the cult. And this is kind of the second wave that hits them is like um to try to pull them back in or to, you know, solidify that they're out and then kind of list them as a defector or like put them on the plug the holes list or like potential, you know, detractor list or whatever that so um so yeah.

SPEAKER_05 6:53

But okay, thanks guys. Um yeah, so I had just left and I was pretty certain in my new perspective that I was in a cult that um I was being manipulated, that I wasn't seeing clearly. And so my exit was very I I didn't give them very much information. I was just like, I'm no longer resonating. I just want to do my own thing for a while. Like, I love you guys, no hurt feelings. And so obviously that's not a very satisfying answer when you've just spent multiple years with people and you're very close. But I didn't know how to untangle because I knew that if I gave my newfound perspective, it wouldn't be heard. So I was trying to tiptoe away and get space. So Corey, obviously, we were really close. Um, she messages me and she says, Um, I just want to get a feel for what's going on. Like, actually, no need to justify or anything, but feels weird, especially if there's a wall-up. If it was 100% in integrity, it would be easy to talk about, no? But you seem to be kind of avoiding me conversation a few days ago too. So now I'm realizing you may be having a visit, meaning a visit from a negative entity. And at this point, I just like like I missed her. I said, Corey, I love you so fucking much. I'm having a hard time with some topics around Ben, waking up to some things. I haven't felt this great in a long time. Because honestly, I was suffering so much. And now being like, oh wow, I'm that that mode of operation isn't real. I like felt like myself coming back. Um I wish I felt more free to just girl talk with you, but it doesn't feel safe, to be honest, that I can actually express what I feel because of your closeness to him. And then when she says I'm having a visit, I replied, and all I can say to this is fuck that shit. Someone disagrees with Ben and it must be an entity attack. I said, It's truly not about you. I really miss you. She says, It's not about disagreeing with Ben. What? It's about totally switching up, it's about feeling like something went 180 in you, and now you're distant. Don't want to talk, want to separate from us and the team and the company. By the way, I haven't shared anything with Ben. So this is where she's like opening up like you can trust me. She says, I think I would only if it felt really aligned to do so or made sense. So far, I'm trying to figure out what's up with you. So this felt like genuine because of our relationship at the time. I said, I actually don't at all want to separate from the team. I just don't feel an alignment to Ben. So it doesn't feel right that I continue to work there for him or me if my heart feels off. That wouldn't be serving anyone.

SPEAKER_02 9:36

She says I almost feel like when she says, I I haven't shared anything with Ben, it's just yeah. It's really just a yes. Of course. So it's kind of like this window of opportunity you have to kind of like get close with her and get right so that you guys can form closer and then you know she can't.

SPEAKER_05 9:49

She won't tell daddy the bad news, you know.

SPEAKER_02 9:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 9:53

Ultimately she will.

SPEAKER_02 9:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 9:55

She says, What's going on though? Why don't you feel in alignment with Ben? Is there something legitimately off? So far, when you have doubts, you come back like, oh my god, fuck, I see what's really going on. I can't believe I doubted him, the vision, etc. I'm so grateful for his patience, etc. So just wondering if one of those doubts hooked you extra deep this time, or if there's something actually off. And if there is something actually off, why not address it and lean in and fix it and balance it out? And so, like, that's you're you're told to lean in because they need to thought correct you. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:25

It's also if something's actually off, it has to be you. She's saying, if something's actually off, it can't. It's not that it was Ben, you know.

SPEAKER_05 10:32

Yes. Let's try and fix this. So you're back into, oh yeah. Um, and I said, I feel used. And based on the text he just sent me, Bentinho, the aim is to make me see where my perception and mind is off, because he can feel our souls are aligned. So this must be some ego strategy or a person feeding me a thought. I don't like the level of control he's trying to have over independent thought, while at the same time friendly stating, but of course you are free to think whatever you want and let truth prevail. So then she says, Okay, still just listening, reading, feeling in. You really think he doesn't see something huge like this? And what about that big sneaky stuff with you that he was able to pinpoint and help you purge? How do you see that now? So he's referring to this like forced confession where I'm like seen something like that.

SPEAKER_06 11:18

But we already shared, and that's what we are saying is he puts that in the group so that now any time that there's something coming up, he can point back. Remember when Jacqueline admitted that she was sneaky? So the distrust is already placed on that plate, not his.

SPEAKER_05 11:33

Uh, do you think he's manipulating me? Which I do. Um, and then she writes, me and Kelly are in that group and we're not rich. So this was referring to earlier what we were talking about, where one of the ways that I felt like he was manipulating was that he had this group chat with women that he's like, You're my most trusted devotees, but they were just like his mo most wealthy. And then he's asking everyone for money. And so her and Kelly were in that group, but they were like his closest girlfriends at the time. Um, and so replying to her, do you really think he doesn't see this? I said, Yeah, I do. My God, I've spent a lot of time pondering this. I'm open to being wrong for sure. Knowing what I felt to be true about this density, speaking in Love One terms, I would never come to any conclusion ever again. Uh, but what if the paradox? So this is also me trying to fit this new belief into my old spiritual belief system. I'm like still trying to figure it out. I said, but what if the paradox is that Ben is helping us wake up, but not through his loving purity, but also through his shadow? And the mission isn't what we think it is. It's just to wake up and shine. Um, also because Ben kind of presents himself like one of those gurus where they do these absurd things to help you pop out of your mind, like cutting off your hand, or like it's like so jarringly opposite of what you think. So I'm still thinking like maybe that could be true. I said, I think Ben is tuned in and gifted, brilliant, and has access to things others can't see. I'd say he definitely tapped into things I'm grateful to see in myself. And I see him do it for a lot of people. The thing about Shadow is that it can be 90% good and have a really selfish 10%. I'm just trying to say that, like, maybe there's like a lot of good here, but there's a really evil 10 that is like manipulating. Um, I also think everything about me was blown way up because Ben wanted to feel safe, and I had exposed something personal about him to a cult member. Um, I think it's gross that he asked her to videotape me to see what I'm like off camera under the guise of helping me, but truly, I think he's just paranoid. And then I said, I think smart people can manipulate smart people. Did we talk about that? What?

SPEAKER_02 13:41

How you recorded?

SPEAKER_05 13:44

It that was actually it found out to be Cars's idea, but nobody stopped them. Yeah, but they they were trying to get intel on on They were trying to see like if I'm gonna be super sneaky with like one person privately, if I have like certain tactics of operating. Yep. Um, and then she had told me later, like, oh yeah, I'm sorry, I recorded this and I sent it to them. Like she confessed right away.

SPEAKER_01 14:03

And there's nothing fascist about this, just so you know. Nothing fascist and authoritarian.

SPEAKER_05 14:09

Um she says, another thing is what a negative light you seem to have him in right now. I think it's because he gave you lots of harsh reflections recently with the dishonesty stuff, which I think were warranted and actually caused the pop, meaning like my pop-out experience. Um, but when I think about Ben having a big shadow or whatever, I just don't see it. I don't see negative treatment of people. You seem to have a lot on your chest, so to speak, like negative association with Ben, you need to reconcile. Even when I look for that stuff, though, I see him giving hard reflections that I wish I had the courage to give, not evil or manipulation or shadow. And then I just replied to his Kelly in her comment, but yours too most devoted, and you were the ones going on the trip to take care of him. She says, I don't find Kelly particularly devoted. I would have said you were more or Ari or Raquel. And I said he felt Kelly to be. And I said I also felt like I was more devoted. Um, I think certain things are hard to see when you're very invested in something, whether it be emotional, financially, etc. And then this is about the videotape thing. She says, You think he actually did that? No way. Um, and when I said it could be Ben's 10%, she says, How do you know this isn't your 10%? So everything, it can never be Bentino. It's like always has to be the other person.

SPEAKER_02 15:22

This is nauseating, but it's also weird because it's like it feels like a dream you had almost where you got to fight back and talk to them. But it's like obviously if you saw what you were dealing with, I don't even think you would have bothered saying these things.

SPEAKER_05 15:34

It was really wild. I was like half a foot in either door. But I didn't, I wasn't, I couldn't be manipulated by what she was saying anymore. So it's almost just like frustrating to have this conversation.

SPEAKER_02 15:45

How long was this after you left?

SPEAKER_05 15:47

Uh well, I'd been home for a month or so because of COVID. Um, not able to fly. Um, and then so I'd already been home for like a month or two, and I was like, guys, I'm leaving.

SPEAKER_02 15:56

And you watched the vowel already at this point? Okay.

SPEAKER_05 15:59

Um anyways, how do you really know that it's not your 10%? I don't, which is why I said I'd never draw any conclusions. But I also feel like I just woke up out of a fog. By the way, I am not trying to share any of this with her. She is trying to get this from me. I'm I'm not trying to prove a point or trying to leave.

SPEAKER_02 16:20

So weird because it's like it's also like you're holding up this big thing, this argument, and she like pokes little small pinholes in it. What if you know it's just like her arguments aren't even valid?

SPEAKER_01 16:28

You you know what, Jacqueline is interesting? That when I was um exiting in 2017, a few conversations I had with people, they would say things to me like, I don't understand, you were so dedicated. How is it that you've changed?

SPEAKER_03 16:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:40

And I kept on saying, I'm trying to explain to you because I'm seeing things that are problematic. They go, but how could you have changed? And I go, because there's bad things. They couldn't take in because there's bad things happening. Yes. And he's doing terrible things and he's not who I thought he was. That wasn't part of their equation. So all they could have a mystery about is I don't understand how you were so dedicated and now you're not. That's all only math. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 17:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 17:04

They can never be wrong. Well, I think I just want to add something because not a single person who has left left is allowed to talk to them. And they don't talk to anyone. Even the people that are leaving these programs, um, they're they're kicked out and they don't get to the there's no connection. You either are in this group or you're completely out.

SPEAKER_01 17:23

Wait, so you're saying that the people that leave are not allowed to reach back and talk to the inner circle?

SPEAKER_06 17:29

Not even the inner circle. I mean, in these programs. If you see anything wrong, if you're like saying, hey, this is kind of this is uh seems problem problematic. You're not allowed. Like it's either you're in and you believe Ventinio's a hundred percent good, but if you have even one percent doubt, they see that as a leak. But they can't they can't understand that that's culty. That literally is the is the cult brain turning on where you can't even discuss, you can't even have someone that has a dissenting opinion. And their whole thing is like, we don't control thought, we don't do this, but you can't speak to anyone that's left. None of you.

SPEAKER_01 18:03

Got it.

SPEAKER_05 18:05

Um so in reply to I think smart people could manipulate smart people, she says, I think manipulative people are the only people who can get manipulated. You can only get manipulated by someone to the extent that you yourself are trying to manipulate. So me saying that Bentinho is manipulating me is apparently me proving how manipulative I am. But it's also very interesting. Well, it's it's that's Bentinho speak. And so it's funny when when he says that he's telling Corey that essentially. So if he feels like now I'm manipulating him, obviously doesn't that show that he he's telling on himself.

SPEAKER_06 18:38

Exactly.

SPEAKER_05 18:39

If he's out there pointing fingers at people trying to manipulate him or hurt him.

SPEAKER_06 18:43

That's all he talks about.

SPEAKER_05 18:44

Yeah. Um, she says, you feel like you've drawn a conclusion, which who the fuck cares if I have? Like, really, I'm not doing it. Why is she so threatened? Like at this point in time. Why is she so threatened? At this point in time, I have no intention of ever talking about this publicly. None. Not an ounce. I literally just want to go back to my life. That's not allowed. Um she says, remind she says, reminds me of Ayla or Brent, which is really was really jarring for me because I had been suffering mentally so much at that time. And Brent obviously was on the team and he ended his life. And to realize that he also was having, like, this is the first time I heard, like on a confidence high because of this independence or confidence, but energetically feels chaotic. Like I can't believe with my head.

SPEAKER_01 19:32

She knew that he was having problems.

SPEAKER_05 19:34

Oh, yeah. He was on he was on the team. And what I'm imagining now is that he's having these moments of like, something's not right, I know better, or like he's trying to have a different perspective, and they're saying, no, no, no. Obviously, it wasn't there to be.

SPEAKER_01 19:53

Corey knew that Brent was having problems before he killed himself.

SPEAKER_06 19:57

Not only that, she's the one that told him, You should come to this retreat, it's going to cure you. This is gonna heal help you. And that's the retreat that was his last. And he worked for Ben. I actually just found that out. I didn't know he worked for Ben. He was in the inner circle for a really long time, and Ben was very hard on him because he was attractive, he was talented, he was all the things that Ben is threatened by.

SPEAKER_01 20:21

So you probably noticed the silence and the struggle they're having talking about this. Almost a decade later, and it's still hard for them to talk about Brent. Brent Wilkins was a longtime member of the Inner Circle, one of Bentinho's most devoted students for years. In December 2017, he was at a 12-day retreat in Sedona. Around day six, he left the group, walked out to Midgley Bridge, and took his own life. Before his death, Bentinho had told the group at the retreat Brent was part of that they should wake up to what's important, or there's no point in living.

SPEAKER_00 20:58

So wake up to something important. Otherwise, kill yourself. Because there's no sense in living your life.

SPEAKER_01 21:13

Getting someone out of a group like this isn't always just an emotional exercise or a philosophical one. Sometimes it's life or death. One of the cult experts once told Bonnie and I, everybody leaves a cult eventually. They either get disillusioned, they get kicked out, or they die. Those are the three exits.

SPEAKER_05 21:32

I think I've made a note about this. Um being compared to a person who has um left the group or like dissented in some way, um, that's like a threat or punishment in and of itself. Um yeah, him leaving the group on terms that you don't agree with. So like these people who leave, that is now. Oh my gosh, I'm sorry. I'm like so emotional about this. I can't think. Um someone leaving the group on terms that you don't agree with or speaking about or speaking out is seen as the worst thing a person can do. So someone leaving, having dissenting thought or speaking out against it, that's literally the worst thing anyone can do. That's pure evil. Then if you're in the cult and you're being compared to someone who does that, that is like such an intense psychological threat. Um, and it's used so often in here when they say, like, uh-oh, Jocelyn. And like I'm sure I'm 100% positive, all three of us are now like that new name. Um, when people start questioning things, oh, you're acting like Jaclyn.

SPEAKER_01 22:38

So basically having freedom of thought is evil.

SPEAKER_05 22:42

Having a different opinion is dangerous.

SPEAKER_06 22:44

So like knowing this is this is telling how Corey sees what happened to Brent. She's she's saying, like, Brent was obviously distorted, and that's why he did what he did, and he obviously felt some weird way about Ben and the cult and the cult and whatnot. And now she's saying that you're in that same frame of mind. There's so many like layers to how disgusting and terrible this is in so many directions.

SPEAKER_02 23:09

Yeah, she's still she's saying that Brent, even after ending his own life, like what he he was still wrong. Yes. Like his his his train of thought is wrong.

SPEAKER_01 23:18

So them that is them, what they did had nothing to do with him committing suicide at all.

SPEAKER_06 23:22

Not a not a not a doubt in their mind, and that's why we're doing this fucking podcast.

SPEAKER_01 23:26

That is really convenient. That's convenient.

SPEAKER_06 23:30

That's very thing, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 23:32

Isn't isn't there something about taking responsibility in this group?

SPEAKER_06 23:35

Only on the the theme.

SPEAKER_02 23:37

Yeah, they have. I mean, Ben leads whole retreats on honor and integrity and you know, a bunch of good sounding words.

SPEAKER_01 23:43

Just checking. All right, here we go.

SPEAKER_05 23:45

Um, so the last thing she said was, I can't fill you with my heart. And I said, You only fill me with your heart when I say something that resonates with your belief. It's like I'm I'm realizing all of these things. Like, oh wow, you're so bright, you're so clear. Whenever I'm in love with Ben, Jacqueline, you're so powerful and bright and clear. Whenever I have a thought that's the opposite, oh, you feel really like I don't feel you right now.

SPEAKER_01 24:06

Um it feels to me like sister wives policing each other. Oh yeah. Right? Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 24:13

Yeah. Um she says, and you said you've woken up out of a fog so many times. And the last awakening you had, where I was asking your advice, you felt so clear and bright. No judgment, no anti-vibes. Because it's like it's a low vibration to have like low vibes.

SPEAKER_06 24:28

But um discernment. That that's really important because she's saying you've woken out of this so many times. And that's why they don't understand why we're speaking out, because many, many times I would say, This feels wrong. And then we do this little distortion, hypnotic bullshit until 5 a.m. And I wake up and I'm like, okay, oh, I see. And she's done this every time. So she has all these like ticked marks in her head of like Jaclyn did this so many other times. This is just one of those times where she just isn't making the leap.

SPEAKER_05 24:57

Mm-hmm. She says, You know that's not true. We've been together way too much for you to think that, LOL. Sometimes you piss me off. Um, but it resonates and I can't deny it. And with Ben, do you really think he just wants personal safety, LOL? Really? Or does he want devotion? Because that's about as close as our minds can get to unity while we're still separate. And it's an utter investment in our realization and unity. Um, and I said, Yeah, this part I have a really hard time with. And she says, When I have a pop-out experience, I get a surge of obviousness, like, holy fuck, how did I ever doubt him? I'm so grateful, this motherfucker is so patient with my doubtful ass. And then I just said, Because he teaches enlightenment teachings. I don't know what I was saying.

SPEAKER_01 25:39

Just one thing I want to go back to for a quick section. She says, Or does he want devotion? Because that's about as close as our minds can get to unity. So devotion is basically being closer to God. So if you're devoted to him, you're closer to unity, you're closer to God. Closest. Because he is the representation of God on earth. Absolutely. Yes. Yeah. Got it.

SPEAKER_02 26:01

This is a side note, but just the the L O L really aspect of Corey's bullshit is so like high school bullyish, and it just makes you feel like she's attempting to make you feel fucking stupid.

SPEAKER_05 26:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 26:11

Like it's really annoying.

SPEAKER_05 26:13

But it also just points to how certain she is in her perspective. You know what I mean? Like to her, this is so obvious that gross. Um, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:22

You know, just something that Bonnie and I were talking about the other day is some of the women, not all, but some of the women around Rainier had a kind of arrogance to them. Um I'll say Claire Bronfman is one of them. Claire Bronfman, extreme arrogance. I'm not saying anything illegal lawyers. I'm not saying anything that's problematic lawyers. I'm just saying that's my perspective. Here's some text, Mark. Let's get up. Um I have so much shit. But but what happened is he empowered certain people and made them feel like they were really, really special. And they became the devoted soldiers that basically like managed and policed everybody else because they were led to believe that they were amazing and special and it went to their heads.

SPEAKER_06 27:07

Ramsey and his dogs.

SPEAKER_01 27:08

And there were certain people that it went to their heads. And I have to say, from the outside, I feel like the empowerment that he's given Corey has gone to her head.

SPEAKER_05 27:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:17

I think he referenced her as one of the clearest people on the side. That's the highest.

SPEAKER_01 27:22

That's the highest of the high.

SPEAKER_05 27:24

You can skip to the next one. Yeah. Um, when she says, reminds me of Ayla Brent. I said, This is manipulative too. And she goes, dude, I'm not manipulating you, Jack. It's me, LOL. And I actually don't think she thinks she's manipulating me. Like, I don't think in here she's she thinks what she's doing is trying to manipulate me. It's just the program running. Um, I said, I'm just saying, I'm not in. I'm not his devotee. She says, Okay, feels weird, but ugh, I don't know. And then I said, I feel your heart. I don't doubt your intentions at all. I don't doubt Ari's. I just feel like Ben has a shadow he doesn't acknowledge.

SPEAKER_01 27:58

And she says, How do you know it's so spot on? You're so spot on. I know. It's amazing. I know.

SPEAKER_05 28:04

I had one moment of clarity. Uh she says, How do you know it's not your shadow, dude? You're smart as fuck. You probably feel okay with me and Ari because you're smarter than us in a way, able to manipulate us if you want to. You can read us.

SPEAKER_01 28:18

I have news for you. She's smarter than Bentinho.

SPEAKER_05 28:21

Me? Yes.

SPEAKER_02 28:23

This feels like this feels like an octopus that's trying to just get you with one of its tentacles, throwing everyone at you. She's trying to You're outside of the tank now. And so it's you just meet in the glass, and it's like it's like, ew, what the fuck?

SPEAKER_01 28:35

And I just want to say something. I'm just reading ahead, able to manipulate you can read us, you can't read Ben. Yes, she can, motherfucker. She can read Ben.

SPEAKER_06 28:43

But they think Ben's a mirror. Like he's not doing anything that's him. They say no, no one's home inside of his body. So you're just seeing parts of yourself. So that's what's so fucking self-sealing about this. Because if you're saying he's doing this, that they're like, oh no, I already know that it's you. There's no there's no one home with Ben. And that's what we're trying to say. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:03

Mirrors don't go boo-hoo. Yeah. For me.

SPEAKER_05 29:06

She says you can't read Ben. So this just feels like some sketchy twister way to get power over someone who isn't even fighting you for it. And I was like, dude, I'm not fighting anyone. You called me in this conversation.

SPEAKER_02 29:16

Leave me alone.

SPEAKER_05 29:18

I said, I don't want power. I just want to live my life. I didn't even want to share. And she says, like to make Ben wrong, essentially. But okay, I can step back and see the big scheme of things and be like, okay, cool, do your thing. And then I said, Why do you think you see it so much more clearly than me? She says, But this feels like a thing. Like something's up. True clarity feels inspiring. This feels shady and avoidant and cocky. It would be easy to look up to you if this were in alignment. How do you know what's in alignment? But I was looking up to you recently in your last breakthrough. Then something went sour. This is how this feels. Um, and like Frank, Frank Yang feels inspiring. Honorog. You can be free as a fucking bird without making Bentinho wrong. Why aren't I allowed to make him wrong and walk away? And calling him manipulative and um basing your independence off his malice. I didn't even offer that. I you asked me. Um, especially how fucking pure Ben is of all people. She's getting upset.

SPEAKER_06 30:14

Right. Because it's threatening her belief system. She's right now, Jaclyn, who she trusted on this high, high level, just a little under Ben, is threatening everything that Corey has based her existence on. So this is about the worst thing that could happen to Corey, where she's like, it's cognitive dissonance. It's the same thing as when I core Keelan was in my room and Corey's on one side and I'm on the other. It's like that pain, that it's it's you can't have one and the other.

SPEAKER_01 30:53

Yeah. One other quick thing I wanted to say is that I'm sure in the teaching somewhere is the idea, probably, that the problem with us lowly mortals is that we confuse our sense of self with our feelings and with our thoughts, right? Mm-hmm. And with the people we're attached to. So the confusing yourself with something other than the true self is not good. But it seems to me that she's confusing herself with Bentinho. So she thinks an attack on Bentinho is an attack on her. Right? So she's not I'm saying this for the people inside who might one day listen to this. Like if you truly if it is a problem to confuse your sense of self with other people or your feelings or your emotions, then surely you shouldn't do that with your guru either. Because that's a limit limitation. So why are you getting so angry? Because you're confusing yourself.

SPEAKER_06 31:46

But Ben says that with your Lord and Savior. Ben, our Lord and Savior says that every single thing he ever says is your higher self. So that's why there's no question in any of their minds, because everything that he ever says is actually the the smarter version of you speaking to your dumb version.

SPEAKER_01 32:05

Well, then the smarter version of everybody is a bit of a cunt sometimes, I guess.

SPEAKER_05 32:09

A bit of, yep. Um when I said, Why do you think you see it so much more clearly? She says, All I have to go on is how stuff feels. I don't see clearly, but I know which way to follow. It's a simple yes or no. And right now you feel like a no out of the blue. I wonder why. Which is unrelated to Ben. It's skepticism and judgment, I think. Seeing things in a bad light instead of a good light with faith and optimism. But you're sort of saying it's all love and you want to respectfully pull away, but it does not feel loving or transparent or pure. And then she, I guess I had to leave. She says, Hey, are you done with the convo? What's up? I think one of my kids can come in. She says, and then I said, I can know it's all love and also have my own thoughts about what's going on on certain levels. I was like this in my head, I was like, okay, we're all one. Everything is love ultimately. I still believe that. And then in this 3D matrix of reality, there are some, there's some shit happening. Um I can know it's all love and also have my own thoughts about what's going on on certain levels. Wasn't feeling you would resonate, which was why I didn't want to share. I just wanted to do my own thing for a while. I feel off about Ben. That's why I wanted to go my own way right now. I'm not trying to make a statement or win anything. I love you. I have to drive, be back later. And then FYI, I'm sharing our convo with Ari and Ben, just so you know.

SPEAKER_02 33:24

The time for correction has passed.

SPEAKER_05 33:26

Hey, shit is weighing on my heart. But so she and Ben have had now have had a conversation about me privately. Ben shared some feelings. He's resisting the temptation to reach out because it feels like such a closed door from you and wants to not repeat his cycle of over-engagement. But he's going to do that through Corey anyways.

SPEAKER_01 33:42

Is it possible that he's just upset? Is that really is is he just upset maybe? Is that what's actually going on?

SPEAKER_05 33:48

Well, he's probably upset and he probably also is really scared. How could this person that was so devoted is now is not talking like something bad is around.

SPEAKER_06 33:55

The woman I took this money from, who's had doubts about me this entire time, is a fire hose that's like in his mind leaching all over. So he's trying all of his hooks to get Jacqueline's brain back.

SPEAKER_05 34:07

So she forwards this message from Mantinho. Yeah, for me, it's fine that she had her perspectives and doubts about me. What I'm not cool with and what I find lacking real integrity is the way she's not committed to the relationship after everything. Fuck that weak ass BS. Um, and so it's also interesting here because it is the doubts that he has a problem with. That is literally the negative entity attack, is the doubts I'm having. Um, relationships get confusing and trippy and challenging at times, but we push through, or at least we give one another fair communication opportunities. So, this community fair communication thing is how they hook you every time. When you go in with an open mind to communicate, you will never arrive at your own perspective. That's not the goal of the communication. So this is a screenshot. But I would like her to understand somehow that there are two things at play. One, she doubts my integrity, which is fine. No, it's not. Two, she's not honoring the friendship and mutual commitment and all the intimacy and trust shared prior to this moment. One, I am okay with. Two, I am not, and it could pose an obstacle for her potential reunion with me and the team. So there's another little threat sandwiched in there. First is human. Second is conscious betrayal of trust and hearts. First is necessary even from time to time, at least in the early stages of trusting someone. Second is never necessary unless the person you're breaking away from is totally abusive or something.

SPEAKER_06 35:30

Well, he gave you permission.

SPEAKER_05 35:34

This is what I feel like too. This is Corey. Like, this is what hurts me. Not that you have doubts. I've had tons of phases of doubts along the way, including, including of Bentino's integrity and merit. But that you just make up your mind and piece out and say, fuck Ben, essentially, instead of having the conversation and taking the risk of being Why is being wrong such a negative?

SPEAKER_06 35:52

What if you are having why is that so why is that so such a high cliff?

SPEAKER_05 35:57

Yeah. What if you are having a negative visit? Wouldn't you want to at least find out why so insistent and protective of your new opinion? And at this point, I stopped, I stopped replying at that point. And I think we've dialogued more. Sorry.

SPEAKER_02 36:10

Just how predatory this is? Like someone's finally left the organization and they're like seeing and thinking clearly for the first time, and then they get smacked with this. Like, and it's also heartbreaking. Like reading this is it's so fucking weird. Like Corey is someone we spent time building a relationship with. And then now you're leaving, you're kind of feeling like yourself again. You go to someone you feel like you can trust, and then they hit you with this, and it's like the the shit just stacks up where you're like, fuck, like fuck, you know, like it's disgusting.

SPEAKER_06 36:38

Also, Jaclyn was best friends with Corey out of everyone in her entire life for a year and a half at this point. So when you leave, you lose that connection. You don't have a best friend. And when you try and interact with them, that's what happened.

SPEAKER_05 36:50

So it's I think it was hard because Corey went through a lot of her confusing times about Ben with me. There were times at the beginning of her relationship with Ben where she's like, I want to, I want out of here. I want someone to get me on a helicopter, I want to go live my life, I'll get a job like at a corporate job. And I'm the one being like, No, don't you see it's your ego? Like, we're doing that for each other. And so now me going out is like super threatening for multiple reasons.

SPEAKER_02 37:17

It's so crazy because you're bonding over this like fake board game. Like you and Corey are like playing this game and like, oh no, and you're helping each other correct it when you're wrong. You've bonded over that. And you're like, where are you? We used to play this game together. Where'd you go?

SPEAKER_06 37:28

Same cycle, except for Corey was the first person and then me, and then I did that to Paula, and it just continues on and on.

SPEAKER_01 37:36

Right. It's a good metaphor, it's a very good metaphor. Um, is it are these more of yours, Jacqueline?

SPEAKER_06 37:42

No, this is Jade's.

SPEAKER_01 37:43

Ah, perfect. Uh should we move on to Jade for the stuff? Yeah. Can you set it set it up for us?

SPEAKER_06 37:50

So these are complicated because everyone is confused of why I was so like sexual or so seemingly like into these things. And so I just want to clarify that while I was in there, I thought everything felt good. I thought I was doing the right thing. I'm being told by this person who's my teacher, hey, this is what like good, good, like if a dog is getting a treat, every time they do one thing, they're gonna keep doing the thing that gets them a treat because they're like, oh, I'm obviously on the right path.

SPEAKER_02 38:19

So again, there's these Yeah, and this is the path for your highest salvation and enlightenment that you believe you're following.

SPEAKER_06 38:25

And and for me, it wasn't like I I was more interested in finding my deepest self. Like I'm I'm a poet, I like writing, I like, you know, art. I wanted to go to the deepest level of of myself. And I've always dated people that were not into spirituality, so I was like, wow, this is such an opportunity for me to have someone that thinks like I think, and that was my big mistake. Um, so there's just some guys in the thing, they're like, you just said yes, and now you just you just regret it, and you say no, like how was that rape? I'm like, because I was given false guidelines, I was given a fucking lane, like when they put bumpers on a bowling thing alley, and there's only one way it could go. Um, so, anyways, I'm just probably will explain that long way along the way. So, this is me and Corey's personal chat. Um, at this point, we were in I think Santa Teresa, March 26th. This was right after the um Costa Rica retreat where I tried to kill Ben, my STS. This was the degrading, um what's the part, what's the devaluing phase where he had found his like new queen and it was Paola, and he was like grooming her along the way because she saw him so much as her teacher, she wasn't interested in him sexually. She was like, had watched this person on YouTube for five years and was so invested in him that when she invited he invited her to come along, he she was like really knew this was a huge opportunity, but did was not interested in him, as all of us were not. Um so uh at this point, we just get to this new really high up in the mountains, Airbnb, I think in Santa Teresa. And this is where he kind of this is what he did. I was in Costa Rica, or we were in um Ecuador, and he moves me without the team, just me, him, and Corey in cars in Panama. And that's when he zeros in. So he goes like this with the girl once he gets her brain right, then he goes back to the team. And so this was our moment where we're we're all the team and then we zoom in. So it's just the three of us, girls and him, and this place where you can't even walk to town to get food. Um I said, Hey, did I offend you with the silly comment in the pool or are you feeling good? She says, Corey says, I feel good. It did feel Can we just talk?

SPEAKER_01 40:28

I just want to uh understand what what what what's this about the coming?

SPEAKER_06 40:32

So I'm gonna I it kind of goes into it, but basically, um, we arrive, uh Ben opens this champagne bottle after he held hands with Paola and I gazed with her in front of me for four hours. And and then remember, like in Costa Rica, he was saying, you're you're falling, you're doing all these things that you didn't used to do, and like, where's your light? And so I'm desperately trying to just get right with my soul at the same time. This the only person I'm allowed to connect with that's that's like I'm only allowed to be with one man, is saying, Now I'm not now we can't be together. Like now you're just too disgusting, so you need to figure out what that is. And he's love bombing this woman in front of me, which is just about the sickest thing. Like it's one thing when it's happening to you, and then you get devalued, but while you're seeing him love bomb one and degrade you in another, that's like another hell. Um, and that's his MO with every girl. That's what he did with me and Corey too.

SPEAKER_02 41:23

Yeah, and when he tells you you've fallen off your soul's path, you're willing to accept and tolerate anything. So now him eye gazing for four hours with another woman in front of you is a chance to get right with your soul and your evolution.

SPEAKER_06 41:34

And what's crazy is while that was happening, Corey was driving, my stomach was like ready to vomit. Like four hours I was feeling so fucking sick. And it's crazy because everyone's like, What's wrong with you? Like, why can't you get your head right? That it's all like you're in your psychological like living room wondering how this furniture has moved around when it hasn't. He's just told you it has. So that's what's psychotic about it. Um, so at this point, this is where some fairly fucked up shit happened because I'm like trying to get back to my light. He's grooming this new girl that doesn't want to fuck him. Like, she's literally so young at this point. And so I feel like this dog in a cage, and Corey doesn't want to even have sex with Ben ever, but she will if he asks her to, because she knows that's her lesson. So we're all sitting up in this high fucking house, and he wants us to become like a human fucking like I have a thought, we all have the same thing. Social memory. We all have the same thought. Like he was trying to hook our fucking spirits up together. So he pops this $500 bottle of champagne, he's like, I found my wife, and he's toasting in front of me and Corey to Paula, and they're like it was so weird. And I know I'm not supposed to feel he's it's okay.

SPEAKER_02 42:50

Sorry, but just like when you when you told me that he literally had you, Corey, and Paula, this new student of his that he recruited that came to fucking Costa Rica that he pulled aside, hasn't seen her family since today, to this day. It's been five, six years, like maybe she's gone home a few times, but like since then pulled off the whole trajectory of her life for years. But he had the three of them meditate together to form a hive mind. Like he's running like thought experiments with women where he's essentially trying to get them all to like be one fucking entity. It's disgusting.

SPEAKER_06 43:22

Also, I've never believed in that in my life. Like that's so n insane. But at that point, I was willing to do anything. Like, what what he's saying that Paul Paula was like way more high um spiritually than me, and I needed to really focus on her to beam back at me what I was missing. And so they're in the pool at this point, and he's like really being romantic with Paola. So he sits down and he says, Look, now you're my w you're my spiritual wife, essentially. You're my Mary Magdalene, which is what he tells every woman in there. Um, you're going to have but I have the healing penis. He gives her the same fucking whole story, and you're gonna have to have sex with other Women with me and your and I'm gonna have to have sex with other people. And Paula's like, what the fuck? Like, she was like, that's not normal for me. And he's like, she was really fighting it, fighting it, fighting. He couldn't get through to her. So he said, Okay, I'll give you an option. I never do this, which he did this with Allison. I'm going to give you a chance to be monogamous with me for just a little bit of time. So you can kind of get used to like what's going to happen, but it's going to be harder for you because when when I bring another woman in and you've gotten used to that, like that's going to be tough. He expected her, I think, to say, okay, then I'll just start at the hard point. But she was like, no, no, that'll be better for me to like wade myself in this pool of hell.

SPEAKER_01 44:38

So we're And does she believe at this point that for her spiritual growth she needs to have sex with him because he's convinced her of it?

SPEAKER_06 44:45

Honestly, it was like me that can that was convincing her.

SPEAKER_01 44:51

Because we I get it.

SPEAKER_06 44:53

Because we were sitting there. I remember when he was toasting the champagne, and it's like it's such a weird psychological thing because Ben's like offering her this like love that I've wanted, that like I wanted like if you're if I'm only allowed to be with you and you are not guaranteeing me anything, not even a handhold. That's that's manipulation if I ask him to touch my hand. And so like Paula's like just saying it's so weird, like you're my teacher, like I don't see you like that. And he and he knew he knew he turned around because he could feel me. And he was like, Jade, tell Paula what kind of opportunity is in front of her. And so I'm I'm just telling her like the things that Corey told me, like, wow, this is like such a huge opportunity. You do you understand? Like, I was frustrated because like fuck, if you're if you're getting this chance, like either like shit or get off the pot. And so it's like a really complicated, fucked up thing. So we were in the pool, and um Can I can I just say one thing, Jade?

SPEAKER_01 45:59

I do think it's important to point out for the audience to understand. If you had said no, you're not gonna tell her what would have happened.

SPEAKER_06 46:09

I mean, I was so it's weird when you ask these questions because again, I never had a no in my body. Like I wasn't that wasn't even on the plate. But there is no no, and that's what I'm telling you about like these cults. Like, there is no no. The only no's that happened is like Jaclyn's so far out, like, but I would have been in trouble. I would have gone down lower than like I was even at at that point.

SPEAKER_01 46:31

Right. Because my sense is that we the the right you arrive at the there is no no because there's something that happens before where the dot where like you get beaten or punished or whatever it is, and so eventually you arrive at the point that there's only this choice. Because on some level you know you know what happens if you try the other choice. That I'm just kind of mapping it out.

SPEAKER_03 46:50

That's crazy.

SPEAKER_02 46:51

Also, there is there's you've clearly stated many times when he was holding you, whatever it and like wrapping you up like a bow constrictor, or even in the car, you just said your stomach is like like there is a fucking no in your body, dude. There was a no that entire goddamn place. Yes. Like it's your mind that's uh fucking you know, it's that's that's what got fucked up.

SPEAKER_06 47:10

That's the that's a fucking phenomenal point, is that that is true. There was a no in my body, and that's why the consent thing that people don't understand is like he doesn't let you connect with your body. That's why all of his fucking teachings are dissociative. They are literally about your head because this is your truth seeker and your truth teller. And if you cannot have access to that, like I didn't trust my body, I didn't even trust my mind. But it's really creepy, Mark, honestly, when you asked the like what would what would have happened? I'm like, I don't know. I wasn't even looking at that direction. It's crazy.

SPEAKER_01 47:40

Well, you you would have been trained into that place by something that happened before. Yes. You know, like this is not a good metaphor. Rainier used this metaphor with us. He talked about, you know, dogs and invisible fences. Like, you know, the first time it gets zapped, and then eventually it doesn't even get near the fence.

SPEAKER_06 47:58

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 47:59

And it doesn't sit and think, like, oh, it's because I'm gonna get zapped.

SPEAKER_05 48:01

It's just in your body, you're like, ah, well, I think Jade was just manipulated by all the stories of the ex-girlfriends. She looked at us and all the questions that we had, and she was like, No, I won't do that.

SPEAKER_06 48:12

I feel like actually, when I think about it, we are seeing what happens when you say no, because Paula was saying no. One of the other women is going to tell you and put your mind back into place. So, like, and Paula was realizing how in trouble she was getting. Like, he's just it was really crazy to see the three of us like groom group grooming each other with just one question from him. He'd just say one thing, and then we know we need to take care of it. And again, at this point, Paula's nervous system was had been starting to get trained to be his. And so me and Corey are already like Ben is upset. Oh my god, our lives are about to get fucking terrible. So we better find what's wrong. So yeah.

SPEAKER_02 48:50

You also go ahead.

SPEAKER_06 48:51

Sorry.

SPEAKER_02 48:51

You also had a um, you know, the whole SDS thing where you almost allegedly killed Ben with a thought that you didn't you weren't even conscious of. So, you know, there's like there's things that happen if you step out of balance where like he's he, you know, so it's like you've already been trained on that level.

SPEAKER_06 49:06

Yes, and the threat of being kicked out of the girlfriend's house is just about the worst thing that could ever happen to you. Like, you're and that's what he was threatening me with the entire time, saying, like, you should even be here right now. Like, what is he was you'll see in some of these texts the way that he's speaking.

SPEAKER_02 49:22

Didn't you already get rid of your home at this point, too?

SPEAKER_06 49:25

I had nothing. I had nothing to return to, and now I'm not talking to my friends anymore at home. I'm not talking to my family. Like once in a while, my mom would message me. Um, but I had nothing. And I also believed that this was my community. I believe this was my family. So to be kicked, get kicked out is horrible.

SPEAKER_01 49:43

You know, I just want to say one quick thing for the audience because I I can feel right now there are some people saying, you guys are trying to get Jay to rewrite history. That's not what's going on here. What's actually going on here is I feel, I feel, Jay, this is what I think. I feel like you're still processing some of the stuff. And I know you feel terrible about um how you participated in, you know, what happens with Paola. But like when you when you say things like, you know, that wasn't even an option, it makes sense to me because in that state you were in, it wasn't an option at all. Because it's like, I think you were so dissociated and so frozen that you didn't have to think about, gee, should I do this or should I do that? You're just in trained to do the thing that's required because of all the prior punishments. And I know that people are gonna say, Well, you're trying to convince Jade of this. What happens with most trauma survivors is they don't seem to understand sometimes for a while what actually happened because it's so painful to unpack. And sometimes it takes years, decades to unpack what happened, and you go like, holy shit. So I was in fawn mode or I was in freeze mode. They always talk about fight or flight, but not the two other F's, which is fawn and freeze.

SPEAKER_02 50:57

I also want to talk about just briefly a quick story of, and we'll talk about this maybe more in depth. But when when Bentinio forced Jade to take her clothes off in front of me, my first conscious thought was is she okay with this? My second thought was that's an unhealed thought that I just had because when I was a child, I had to protect my mom from my abusive stepdad. So I need to let I need to be complicit in this abuse. I need to let this happen in front of me. And so that's where moral injury comes into play, and I think that's part of what Jes probably experienced with Paula as well. There's people that let abuse happen in front of them because Bentinho has taught you this is the cutting edge thing to do. This is like, and if you say anything, if you speak up, then you're beaten over the head with a bat over into distortion that has to do with you. It has nothing to do with him. He could kill someone in front of you, and if you have a fucking bad thought about it, it's your fault.

SPEAKER_01 51:46

It's a good point.

SPEAKER_06 51:47

Also, at that point, I wasn't trusting my own thoughts, like we were talking about, and Corey was the one on the pedestal that was still good. And, you know, we're trying to teach Paolo what an opportunity is in front of her while it's being taken from you, so you feel like, yeah, so um thank you guys. I mean, yeah, this is really fucking complicated, and um, I haven't even talked about this part in therapy, so um hey, did I offend you about the silly comment in the pool? Or are you feeling good? Or I said I f I feel good. It did feel a little sideways in the moment. What was the energy around it? I said, no, not at all. But there was on my part, after I felt you think I was speaking badly, which it was just meant as a joke, then I felt self-conscious and bad about it. So I kind of tried to retract it, but I just thought it was funny because you were saying she's like your little sister. So you have to understand that Corey and Corey sees Paula, she kept saying over and over again, you're like my little sister. One, that tells Paula like she's safe, she's with a big sister. Two, that tells you that Corey doesn't want to be sexual with her fucking sister. And guess what? I'm pretty sure that at some point those two had something because it's always the way it goes. Um, I said, but I felt super good with you. So I wanted, I wanted to clear anything up. This point I'm so afraid because Corey was starting to get really mean and like really hard on me and grossed out because now she had Paula and she really jibed with Paula. They were more similar, I guess, and like I wasn't. I said, didn't mean anything serious by it. She said, okay, cool, no, no biggie. Um, she said, something still feels teensy wobbly, but I don't know what it is. So maybe not worth digging at the moment. I said, not on my side. Literally just felt like a flower wilted between us, and that affects me deeply. Okay, a flower wilting between two people is about this tiniest amount of energy, and that's how perceptive my brain is at this point, like to things going off. Um, and then Ben told me to own it, so I trusted it, but you didn't laugh. Then it was just a terrible feeling. So if there is something else on your side about me, please let me know. I would like to clear it. I had the best day with you. She said, uh ha ha. What did he tell you to own? Now, this is the comment we're talking about. The comment that Paula was the sexually into threesome Corey, but Paula isn't even into it, which is why I was just trying to make light of it and thought you would laugh. Now, Ben and Paula were in this pool trying, he was trying to hold her and like she's trying to get used to this as her teacher, all of a sudden becoming her lover. And Corey is feeling relief because she doesn't want to have sex with Ben. She's never wanted to have sex with Ben. It is always seen as a teaching and and a surrender point. So we were in the pool and Ben is starting to like kind of he's trying at first, he was trying to make me and Paula like, you know, have some kind of sexual energy. And at some point we were floating, all the three of us, like he was holding on to the two of us, kind of like flirty, and um, and Paula was being more like genuinely comfortable with it, it seemed at that point, than Corey, because Corey had a lot of pushback. She did not want to be sexual with me, she did not want to hook up with a girl. So um, I was trying to just like Corey was kind of off by the side, and I made a joke in front of her, and I was like, I said to Ben, Oh, like Paula's the sexually enter threesome Corey. And then Corey was feeling othered, so I didn't want to say it to her. And Ben said, No, own it. Like, tell her, say it. So I said it to her, and then I felt her not like that response, and that's what we're talking about here.

SPEAKER_05 55:14

She said, Oh, I kind of didn't get look, look how Ben triangulate he triangulated you in that. Yes. He knew that would start.

SPEAKER_06 55:21

Yes, and he did that to her and me in the next place we went to, and it's just on and on. Um, Corey says, Oh, I didn't, I kind of didn't get it. That doesn't bother me. From my POV, you were hugging them and said something like, We can never do this with Corey. So I didn't get it because like we did lol. So I thought you were sort of randomly and accurately saying I was totally closed all the time, like to the point where a hug with them was more intimate than you, me, and Ben ever got. So admitting to the fact that we've had sex together, that this is a threesome, that we've done that many times at this point. Um, I said, Oh, lol, no. And she said, just was like, huh? I said, Oh, God, no. And I'm laughing because at this point too, I feel like so afraid of her being upset with me. Um, I also really genuinely want to be good with her. She said, Lol, I said, it's also funny because I feel more open with you than her sexually. So, anyways, done joking. Now, never in my wildest thoughts in this point did I even ask, would I want to be sexual with Paola? There was no question. There's no question because you're getting lessons from your teacher. You're following along. So it's like making me sick, the thought of like, I would never, first off, I would never with Corey, but like now the boundaries are moving farther. Now there's other women that I'm I'm pushed into a room with. Um I said, done joking. And then she said, Yeah, a lot of weird misinterpretations flew through the air. Ha ha. And then I send a picture of Anurag in a blanket.

SPEAKER_01 56:45

Why was Honorag? Why did you send that picture?

SPEAKER_06 56:47

That's kind of part of well, I say it at the next slide. I said, This is me.

SPEAKER_01 56:50

Like it.

SPEAKER_06 56:52

Um let me see. Oh.

SPEAKER_02 56:54

It kind of helps diffuse tension, like sometimes, like, and we kind of take on a lot of Benalsen's like silly gifts, so we kind of learn this. Of each other, too.

SPEAKER_06 57:02

And just like, I don't even remember at the time what I was thinking about it, but just like Rags is kind of like looking at the camera, like, mm-hmm meep. Um, she said, separate from you though, I did notice feeling a little dread, like, fuck, is Ben gonna try to pull me into this sexually again, like he did with you? Was enjoying the space to be more friend zoned. But the energy at the pool felt like he was trying to draw me in a bit. So this is what I mean.

SPEAKER_02 57:31

Yeah, you have Corey admitting that she never wanted to do anything sexual with Jade and uh Ben pulled her into that. So that doesn't sound like fucking consent to me.

SPEAKER_01 57:44

Corey has doubts. These are her own words right here in the messages. But her doubt gets relocated. It's never maybe he did something wrong. It's always something's often you a visit, a shadow, your own 10% projected onto him. Every possible explanation gets redirected inward before it's ever allowed to land on Bentino. I'm not sure if that's something she's consciously building. Maybe it's the shape her thinking has been trained into. And underneath it, she's not choosing between being a real friend and reporting back to Ben. Both are true for her at the same time, it seems. In her mind, those aren't even in conflict. Corey, if you ever listen to this, or if somebody else listens to this and can tell you, you were not always on board. Even if the version of you that exists publicly now needs the world to believe you always were.

SPEAKER_06 58:39

It's crazy because like when Paula opted for monogamy, now Ben and her are in the bedroom, they're sharing a room together. I don't know what they would go late into the night, now it's just them. It wasn't me and Corey. So fuck, who knows what happened in that chamber.

SPEAKER_02 58:55

Um these these these are the teachings, though. Like Corey admitting that Ben is pulling her into something sexually with another woman, that's she's okay with that because this is the fucking enlightenment teaching her spiritual teacher is giving her to advance in her evolution.

SPEAKER_06 59:09

And I wish that they would be like this is what I mean by there's some some thread of knowledge that what Ben knows what he's doing because he doesn't talk about his sexual healing. There are gurus who talk about, well, dickheads that are say they're gurus that talk about I sexually heal people, but Ben doesn't talk about that publicly. Why?

SPEAKER_02 59:30

Why doesn't anyone know that Ben and Corey are having sex on and off all through the years It's also like you guys want to sell courses of people's spiritual evolution and shepherding consciousness and light touch? This this is the most advanced course you can get behind the fucking scenes is to be forced to sleep with Ben, another woman, override all of your fucking boundaries of your spirit. That's this is the real course they're selling.

SPEAKER_05 59:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 59:52

I I I want to understand something quickly. So in the teachings the the human material concerns are lower than the spiritual concerns, right?

SPEAKER_06 1:00:04

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:06

That's my understanding. Okay. Then why is fucking elevated so high? Because isn't that just a human thing? That's like what animals do. That's the limbic part of us. Like I'm trying to understand how if being if the human is kind of shit and and the divine is whatever, whatever, like how to make it into the divine as the most divine of all humanity. It really is.

SPEAKER_05 1:00:38

I was just saying it really is confusing, and I think what it comes down to is that whatever you have a reaction to is your area for growth. And so the sex become it becomes not about sex. It becomes to what are you having the strongest physical reaction to, and you need to get over that because as long as you're having an emotional response, you're not evolving.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:57

Renere Reneri did the same thing. It's the most exactly the same thing.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:01

It's it's the most intimate thing you can let someone into your life. Like sexual fucking contact, like it's the biggest way he can get you to disrespect your fucking self. Like it's the biggest thing he can do to shatter your fucking spirit is let someone in, force them to do something with your body sexually with another fucking human being for his pleasure.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:17

And but on the record, every fucking woman who has had sex with Bentino that I personally know of did not want to have sex with him. It was something to be overcame. It was a hurdle that you weren't aware of. And I'm realizing now when you ask that, Mark, is like, why would he need to have sex when he's all doing all of these things with your brain? Because there was a no. Because each woman had a no, and that's the thing to overcome, and that's what we're saying. He's a fucking sadist, and that his his his teaching just follows his fucking, where can I hurt someone? It was never about anything. And I'm like, because he he when he has sex, he doesn't even want to have sex. He said he doesn't even feel interested. He's basically asexual. But there are these times where it feels like that's the only way that that woman chakra can like accept this. And it's like, why would that be from a predator standpoint? Oh, because they're saying no, and to like, like he already invaded your mind to invade someone's body.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:19

Yeah, uh just really quick too, sorry, but if on Silvana's episode, what he's getting you to agree to have sex for is not what's actually fucking happening. So you're doing a business deal that's actually completely fraudulent and corrupted. With Silvana, he's saying it's for her fucking her healing, it's for this this whole spiritual evolution. That's what he's getting, he's attempting to get women to consent to, and it's not what is all fucking happening at all.

SPEAKER_05 1:02:43

Good point.

SPEAKER_06 1:02:45

Um I said, um I don't think you have to worry about that. That's my expertise. And again, this was the thing that from the very beginning, Ben gave me the coaching on like you need to be more sexual. You're not more, you're not sexual enough, you're not claiming me, like you said with Jaclyn. Um, and so he he named he nicknamed me kink, kinky. Like, never in my life has anyone called me kinky. So like that was the thing he was coaching me into, and then that's why the whole team is like, Well, she was such a slut. Why, like, no, I was not. That was what he was telling me to do. It's been really cool energy, the way it's going. Um and she said, I'm just so not into this, but I could see it being pushed on me until I get over it. What more do we need to read?

SPEAKER_05 1:03:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:03:31

Um, I said, I think he was teasing, and she said, How so? I said, I don't think you have to face it. It's not the same as an edge to me. Um, you could hook up with a girl if you needed to, but it's not the same. Just as Ben could hook up with a guy if he needed to, but it's not relevant. I wonder why. Just my opinion. I like the energy of you and I, friends with him and supportive and him and him and Paola mono, meaning monogamous. Because at that point it was kind of like when he wasn't on me, it was like so like Jaclyn's talked about this, it's such a relief when he's on someone else and he kind of ignores you when you're like, oh, I get to work out here, I get to suntan. Like that's your bit that's what you're supposed to work on. I get to meditate.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:13

Um we go back just really quick to that last sentence on the last slide, just because I feel like it's very important. I'm just so not into this, but I could see it being pushed on me until I get over it. That is a summary of how Corey views the spiritual teachings from Bentinio Masaro. Whatever he wants her to do that she doesn't want to do. She's saying she doesn't consent to. He's gonna push on her until she gets over it, and that's her fucking enlightenment path.

SPEAKER_06 1:04:39

And that's who's coaching every woman in there of what is right and what is wrong.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:45

She's coaching the woman's movement, basically her and Rome are teaching the woman about being a woman.

SPEAKER_06 1:04:50

Yeah, it's the scariest fucking thing.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:53

Sounds like uh sounds like uh DOS. DOS to me.

SPEAKER_06 1:05:02

Um I said uh she said nice, I like that energy too, laugh my ass off. Um I said it felt good for me to work through some things and for both of us to be focused on work and and and the energy. And she said, Yeah, it's definitely not a magnetic feeling for me, low cool though. And she said, nice about me working through some things. I said, also he just came in his underwear and laid on my naked body in a towel, and I felt pretty neutral. Progress. Okay, get back to work and I'll see you at the taxi. And she said, Ah, sexy.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:39

And again, uh sorry, just insinuating that she had a real feeling about this, but this she made herself feel neutral about it, and that is spiritual progress.

SPEAKER_06 1:05:49

Yeah, so at that point, Ben was saying, like, I need to have no sexual feelings. I need to also just feel fine with whatever he wants to do, because I'm just like I'm I'm in enlightenment. Like I'm just so amoeba and I think that's why I put it. Is that an amoeba like emoji? I can't see it's so small. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:10

I think it's I think it's underwater. Yeah. But bins are white. So that's yeah, true.

SPEAKER_06 1:06:15

I folded 39 of them. Um yeah. And it's like I was in a towel, I'd just gotten out of the shower. And again, he's like also baiting me because he's saying I can't have sex with you because you're disgusting, and Paula is now my wife. But this is what he's doing while he's telling Paula that he's met his Mary Magdalene. He's coming into my bedroom and laying on me while I'm naked.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:35

Like, what is it with the laying on people? This is this is from Jacqueline's story, too. He just laid it.

SPEAKER_06 1:06:41

And he did that to me as well in the beginning. And and for me at that point it was boundary erosion because he told me explicitly we weren't gonna have sex.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:47

So such a weird it's a visceral submission where he gets to be the force and you submit. That's the only option.

SPEAKER_06 1:06:56

It's like raping someone energetically because you're laying on them and you're feeling their their uncomfortability, and you're literally like sit like siphoning that fucking energy as that woman is actively jumping over her nose into a yes.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:13

And he's is exactly is he just like breathing on you?

SPEAKER_06 1:07:19

And it's like like Mark said too in Silvana's episode, I think. That's so fucking creepy. And was it a challenge? Like for me, yes. When he eye gazed with me, it felt like a challenge. It wasn't an invitation, it wasn't kind. It was the most intimidating shit that you're just like, why am I so afraid? Why is my fucking heart rate elevating right now? And it's obviously never him.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:39

It literally it feels like he had these women in rooms like prison cells, and then he just goes into their cell and lays on them and then you know forces you to eye gaze and just make sure he has this prisoner in his fucking lobby.

SPEAKER_06 1:07:50

He could have done anything. We all had separate bedrooms. We could he could have literally fucking done anything to Corey in her room and done anything to mine, and that's why no one is actually knowing the full thing. Not even Corey, because Paula had a lot of people.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:04

I I had no idea any of this was happening. I had no access to the the what was he was doing with the women. And me and Jade never no one ever talks about this.

SPEAKER_06 1:08:13

Who would I tell? I'm like Texas and Keelan, hey, guess what? Ben Lato on me. Like the this is what I'm saying when he isolates the girlfriends and he goes, he he like zooms in. And and Keelan, right now, I think you were in Mexico, right? Like you guys went back to Casa. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:28

So there's also no no bar for anything. So the eye gazing with me at the beginning, when it was just me, eye gazing, he felt magical. You know what I mean? And then Corey comes into the mix. All of a sudden, Corey's on this pedestal. I enter, him and Corey are now eye gazing all the time. And so he's trying to say, like, look, Corey gets it and you don't. And so he would try an eye gaze with me. And I like, I'm like, go blank. What do I do? Am I empty? There was nothing that I could have done to eye gaze correctly now at this point. Now, whatever I do, I'm doing it the wrong vibration. And then he'll be like, Corey gets it. You don't get it. If you don't get it, you're gonna vibrate away. And that's yes, nothing.

SPEAKER_06 1:09:09

And that's what's so disturbing for people's mental processes because you compare something that happened literally fucking five minutes ago, and you're like, huh, for example, this is so stupid. But when I went to the cult, I was like, I would say, they'd say, Do you understand this now, Jane? I'd be like, a hundred percent. And then Corey and Ben are like, that's a distortion because you're saying a hundred percent. You're there's no way you can get this a hundred percent because you didn't get it prior. Paola fucking comes on the scene and Paula says, a hundred percent. I'm sorry I did that right. I'm just mean like she was she was like really like gung-ho about it, and they didn't say anything to her. And I'm like, how so my brain's like, huh, I'm bad, Paola good. Like it's just really fucking stupid.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:48

That's whatever Ben feels at a fucking whim.

SPEAKER_06 1:09:51

To torture you. It just wants you to make you go crazy, and that's what people don't think. They're like, the teachings. Ben is not doing the teachings, he does he's on his fucking phone with kyphosis all day, hunched, messaging women. Now, flash forward, everyone think about Palace family, who she was from, kind of like, you know, um not a wealthy family in Miami, Florida. And she was kind of just living in her dad's apartment. I think she sold Herbalife and um was like smoking a lot of weed and watching Bentunio on in her apartment. Like that was her her, like, she went into this different world. She escaped what you know was her life um and felt powerful. She she felt like she had control in a situation that sounds like she doesn't have much. And so now she's flashboard, she's traveling with this man. She goes to a treat and doesn't go home. She goes from the uh from uh Costa Rica and we go to Mexico and they go on to um back to Amsterdam and she's traveling South Africa. I mean, her family is and she's studying smiling photos back home, and she's he's buying her clothes and like she's starting to look I was giving her my dresses and doing her makeup and her hair. Like you think someone's happy, and this is what's happening on the other side of it. This was the teachings that Paolo was learning five fucking years ago. Since then, we know that she has had to, she has become a basically a housekeeper at times for the cult because she doesn't have any skills so that no one gets to have a free ride.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:23

Um she's also had to cook a meal for uh one of Bentinho's uh other women he ro roped in and like serve them. So one of this he's done this with multiple women. He'll have a previous girlfriend serve them a dinner and they have to be completely neutral during this dinner after he's discarded them, and then he has them do the dishes and clean up the dinner on this private date with the new woman he's pulled in.

SPEAKER_06 1:11:46

And the new woman will oftentimes feel like please, like I don't need her to do that, and then he will stop them from helping and say, This is for her growth. Meanwhile, that because that's their team. Meanwhile, Paula's just bawling, walking around, bawling through her fucking new um her new learning, her new fucking whatever he's told her. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:07

So we're doing uh Keelan next, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:12:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:12:16

Um, this is my this is me and Corey's chat, but Keelan's gonna talk about it.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:21

Right. So this is this is just important to see how the cult operates after people leave. And uh one of the things this cult does, and I think I'll do, is they they get paranoid after people leave, and they have these meetings where I mean, as Jacqueline showed in her text episode, they have a group chat called Plug the Holes, quite literally. Well, these three holes on this podcast are on the loose, they're unpluggable now, but like this is this is what this is after me and Jade left. The cult didn't know that we were talking to Jaclyn because we kept all of this private because we're super sneaky STSs and we knew that they might think that we were on to something. So they don't know that me and Jade are talking to Jacqueline at this point, and um also a previous employee, Ayla, as well. They don't know that we've connected with past people that have left that have been outed as demons, though. Um so, anyways, this is this is September 27th, 2022.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:13

I think you guys need t-shirts that say super sneaky STS.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:20

Yeah. Um but this date is important because you'll see it's September 27th, 2021. So this is four months after me and Jade left. We haven't come out publicly yet. And randomly on this day.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:32

Wait, yeah, but you did put out something online. You made this post that was alluding to something about Ben.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:38

You're right, Jacqueline, because maybe this is what's going on.

SPEAKER_06 1:13:41

This is what's sent them off. But they didn't This was the 23rd. You post this on the 23rd of September? And she messaged you guys on the twenty third.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:49

Okay, so this is what I wrote one day when I was just like pissed off, and I I hadn't come out against the cult, but I had to say something. And I knew I had an NDA, so I didn't say Mentino's name, but I wrote this. Um I said, There's a devil loose in God's playground. His teachings are sweet, but they contain just enough poison to go down smoothly. The suits he makes will fit you greatly, but tucked away on the inside, there's a hem eloose in every seam. The men that surround him will feel important for sitting next to someone of stature, assured they must be doing something well for themselves. The women he will seduce by giving them a warm hand and a cold shoulder. Afraid of any real intimacy himself, he only seeks relationships that put him in a position of power. If you can make him feel important, he'll keep you around. If you're incapable of doing so, he will cleverly persuade you into thinking there's something wrong with you. He knows his days are numbered, so he loses sleep at night, just a little. Some nights he loses more sleep than others, so he pours himself a drink. He can't taste the poison anymore, but he still prefers it because he's convinced himself it's the cure, which is why he pours the same drink for you. Behind this ignorance lies his ability to convince himself of his own innocence. The devil truly thinks he is up to good. In fact, he is sure of it. That's so good. Um So I wrote this obviously about Bentinho, and within twenty-four hours I think Ari emailed me and said, Hey, uh, take this post down, or it will consider it a breach of your own. Well, then message you first. What's interest. Yeah, he texted me as well. I have a long text of him saying basically, you know, I wish you the path of forgiveness. I saw your post. It was pretty ironically devilish of you.

SPEAKER_06 1:15:19

But there have been nothing. Healing had not talked to any of them. None of us had said anything at this point. So they're still watching our social medias. They're still checking on what we're doing. And again, he's never mentioned Ben's mind. So the fact that Ben literally saw himself is hilarious.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:34

Also, we've been talking now for a month at this point, the three amigos. So they have no idea that we're talking either.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:42

And what's silly is I'd never said Ben's name in that post. And that's why I told Ari. Originally I took it down because I wanted him to think that they had something up on me, and then Ben made this Instagram post basically trying to bash the shit out of me, saying, like, if you judge someone or blame someone, you have mommy and daddy issues, because I took it down and he felt that sense of superiority again. So that post is still on his Instagram. Maybe we can share it at some point.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:02

But anyway, is this is this post still up on your page?

SPEAKER_02 1:16:05

Yeah, it is. Yeah. Good. Um, so this is four days after I made that post. So you can tell I've driven a kind of paranoia through the cult, and now they're having meetings about we need to plug the holes, plug the leaks. Is there anyone that is left in the past that we haven't fully swayed to the to the, you know, at least be passive and choose the path of forgiveness yet? So Jacqueline receives this text on September 27th. Do you want to read this, Jack, or do you want me to?

SPEAKER_05 1:16:28

You can read it.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:29

Okay. So this is from Corey. Um, she says, Hey, you've come to mind a few times over the last few weeks. Always have a feeling of like a best friend on pause. Like, I still love you so much, but we're just not connected at the moment. Just FYI, no negative feelings from my end, in case you ever wondered. Hope you're doing super great. You know, and then Jacqueline sent a kind of heartfelt message back.

SPEAKER_05 1:16:49

This is this is I didn't know she had written anything to anyone else at this point. Like I just responded authentically.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:55

Yeah. And so she kind of sent her a nice message back. So uh September 27th. So if we scroll to the next slide. So this is a text from Corey to me, September 27th. And I'm pretty sure we did the math on the time zones, and this was all within 30 minutes of each other. But she doesn't know where me and Jacqueline know each other. So she says, To me, hey, would you want to talk? I don't know what's going on too much. I know about your post and I know how it affected the team, but I still love you, and was even recently feeling like I missed you. Like that's like, whoa. Was surprised you had pent-up negative feelings. I want to get your world and what's been up. If you're down, let me know. Heart. September 27th. This is a previous employee that left years before um, or like a year or two before me, or something like that. So she goes, Hey Ayla, just swinging by to say you still come to mind sometimes, and I always have this feeling of like, fuck, I love this girl so much, like an ex-best friend who I'm just not connected with anymore. Just letting you know that there's no negative feelings on my end, and I even miss you sometimes, wink face. Hope you and Max are doing wonderful.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:59

I just want to confirm this is from Corey to Ayla. Yep. Got it.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:03

So I don't remember how we all figured out. I think I'd shared that oh Cory texted me and I shared it with Jacqueline. She's like, oh my god, me too. And then I was connected with Ayla at this time, and she's like, What the fuck, me too? And Corey didn't know we all knew each other. But this is just an example of the damage control they're doing, like to be able to quite literally.

SPEAKER_05 1:18:21

But they are within five minutes. She could have sent and she could have, or Corey could have sent that to people we don't know about, too. Like we were just the three people that were talking at that point.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:30

That's very true. Yeah. So this is a text uh we received from a previous employee as well.

SPEAKER_06 1:18:37

This was before before Jacqueline was there, right? This was a while ago.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:18:42

Years before.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:43

I think this is like 2016 or 17. Wait, just let me clarify. So who's sending this to who?

SPEAKER_06 1:18:48

Bentino's sending this to not naming the employee.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:51

The previous employee previous person.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:52

Yeah, previous employee.

SPEAKER_06 1:18:53

Previously in inner circle number.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:56

And this is just great because I feel like he's always been sloppy, but I feel like he was somehow more sloppy back then than I was like, the arrogance is just on yeah, full display.

SPEAKER_06 1:19:04

But also, this was when they were in the cold still. This wasn't like an after thing. Now we're going back to like in this time frame.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:11

This is then kind of like breaking off. Okay, so Bentinho says, You still don't trust me? I really need you to trust me 100% in our work relationship. In our friend relationship, you can do whatever you want. I'm a mirror. If you don't like something, it is you. The same does not apply to me in the same way. Humility means you respect that mirror consciousness is not yet attained in you. And so you should stay humble and not challenge the mirror, for that is a waste of time. So anything Mentinho does, again, we've discussed this philosophy in the cult. If he he does anything in front of you, abuses somebody, anything, and it makes you feel bad, it's your problem, not his. He's perfect.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:44

I'm just trying to imagine walking around feeling like and saying to people, like, I'm a mirror, so I'm so pure that I don't have normal human feeling. So if you're having a feeling, it's really yours and my job on this planet in this incarnation, which is my last incarnation, by the way, um, is to basically show you who you are. That's my gift that I give to the world. I can just imagine saying that, and I'm thinking to myself, like I'm high, or I'm a fucking malignant sociopathic whatever with messianic delusions, or I'm brain damaged. These are my three options right now.

SPEAKER_06 1:20:24

And let's just play the people that are like, he's a good guy. Okay, let's just pretend for one moment that this is true, that like he thinks he's this mirror. Anything he does, like then that therefore dictates that he could do bad things to you, and he really believes that he's it's you, it's not him. That's psychotic.

unknown 1:20:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:46

It is. And I just want to point out, and I'm not saying I don't mean anything by this, I just want to point out in a court of law, I am a mirror doesn't work. So like a normal like the jury, and I know this because I was in a federal trial, the jury is made up of normal people who don't have wacky fucked up beliefs. So if you were to say, well, it wasn't me because I'm a mirror, the jury is gonna look at you like, well, you're insane. There are consequences. So like it's just good to understand how the law works. Yeah. The the mirror, the mirror hypothesis doesn't hold any water, you know, just FYI.

SPEAKER_05 1:21:23

Can I share that we also found out where the mirror being thing originated from? And it was from a group chat with Bentinho and all of not a group chat, like a Facebook group. And someone came into the chat, I guess, asking questions, and Bentinho was giving reflections or saying, like, that doesn't resonate. And the guy said, I'm a mirror being, so whatever you feel about it is yours. And Bentinho did not like that, but he did like the power that that guy had in the group by not having to own anything.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:53

It's like a virus that finds new software.

SPEAKER_05 1:21:55

Yes. But also think about a pure being that's supposed to awaken and enlighten the planet and how much ego is in this text to be like, don't you dare step on my toes.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:05

Even the cold thumbs up of the.

SPEAKER_06 1:22:43

So again, either way, this man needs to go to the mental hospital at least.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:49

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So this is from to the same uh, this is the employee talking back to him and says, She's she's kind of standing up for herself, you know, or she is. And they say, Do what you will. He says, I will. Your bullshit days are over. So full of yourself. They say, You're threatening me now because you're not my guru. He says, Perceiving me to be full of myself. Clearly, you're unclear. Hence, you should devote yourself to me. I I've never expected you to be devoted to me as your guru. I only do so now because you are dropping below the threshold of the minimum trust levels that I can tolerate. You're wasting the time of someone you should receive from, not argue with. I can show you your flaws and open you up to your true self. To a much greater extent. You have always had this bubble or veil around your head that is based on your idea that I'm just another human being, the same as all other people. This is erroneous and has limited you and our connection, but I've tolerated it because you stuck with the group and the activities, even though only on the periphery for most of yourself. But your arrogance of putting this veil, which you cannot see above my clarity, is below what I can tolerate. Hence now I'm bringing it up in the way of being your guru and devoting yourself as such, as a gift to yourself, and to ensure that you will be streamlined for me and not cause these time-wasting ignorant ripples. Your safety has been to not see my true self all this time. Hence, when I interact with you, it is like equals. It is like friends both being deluded. Basically saying you need to treat me as a god.

SPEAKER_06 1:24:18

That's such a creepy line. Your safety has been to not see my true self this entire time, which is actually accurate. Like all of our safeties is because we don't see who he really is.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:30

Also, the just one uh slide back to the sentence that was really telling for me is when he says, Clearly you're unclear. Hence you should devote yourself to me. Meaning if you feel any unclarity about him, the company, anything, life, the answer is to devote yourself to Bentino. That's the only answer.

SPEAKER_06 1:24:48

And that's what they all do in the inner circle.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:52

So this next slide uh after this one is just to show it's an older text from the same time period. I think this was around 2016 or 17, and it's just to show Boner and Donor. Yeah, the the group chat this is in was in Sedona. And um so the group chat names are interesting again.

SPEAKER_06 1:25:10

Allison's in this Bentinho, James, Janet, Jocelyn, Lori, Lisa, Ryan, Brown.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:15

Yeah. This is this is like a decade ago, and this is where Corey was at then. So you can just imagine, you know, where she's at now. A decade ago.

SPEAKER_06 1:25:23

Okay, are we gonna do something about the phone numbers? Yeah, we can edit that out.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:27

I will I will remove the uh phone numbers. Just remind me, please.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:31

Sorry, I didn't see that. Okay, so Corey says, and we can just keep it paused here so you don't have to scroll. Um this this is just a random group chat, and I don't know what the context was. Probably Ben gave someone a distortion reading or something. Corey says, It was cool to read all this. Touching. The devotion I feel to you, Ben, is like laugh my ass off. Not my choice. Laugh my ass off. It's just that nothing compares and competes. I think it's my theme or something to follow you. When I think about you, I cry. Even people who can turn me off to myself can't turn me off to you. So in a way, I don't feel responsible for it or worried about your ego, or maybe even aware of your ego. More just like trying to get back into sync with you, get back into alignment so I can be on par with you. Um I would love to watch. Oh sorry, but Bentino says, Beautiful, I bow to you as deeply as you bow to me. Meaning you bow first, and then you know, I'll give you what I consider to be your evolution.

SPEAKER_01 1:26:28

Is it um I'm just trying to understand Corey from reading this? It feels like somebody who has very little uh sense of self. It feels very permeable, uh like the psyche feels very permeable and very influenceable. Yeah. Or am I wrong?

SPEAKER_02 1:26:46

No, it it feels like the host took over, like you know, this the the person, like completely. Okay.

SPEAKER_06 1:26:54

I mean I would love if we could play this clip really quick in between um from Gabby's YouTube. It's where she's talking about what the advice Ben gave to her when her ex was reaching out. Do you guys could we do that? I just sent it in the group.

SPEAKER_04 1:27:09

What's up? So I've had a few people ask me about trust and specifically related to Bentinho Masaro, who's a spiritual teacher, my spiritual teacher, my friend, um, someone I really look up to. And they've asked me how I know he's trustworthy. And so this question is just always weird to me. It's like um like trust him to do what? Um, so if you kind of want to like drop these trust issues or this obsession with with you know being a victim or there being like an oppressor and there being manipulation present, ask yourself who am I? But actually answer that question. Feel the answer to that question. Like, who am I? If nobody was around it. So I have kind of a I have a boyfriend that I broke up with. But we're still close and he's still super infatuated. He lives in Boulder. And um Ventinio gave me the homework to whenever I see this guy to think about Ventinho. And that's so like effective. Like this guy's texted me a few times. He's like, and my first impulse is usually to be like, and then it's like, what if Bentinho were sitting right here looking over my shoulder? It's like, oh yeah, like sober up. Like sober up. What do I like? It's such an interesting just to imagine that the Tinha's right here. And the other one that I was doing before he ever gave me that assignment was um tune into the stars. Like raw. Like, and that's usually that's useful for like group situations, like when you're around a bunch of people and you can get like hyper like into this sort of group where you're I don't know, you're playing and you're talking and goofing around. And then if you imagine it's almost like it's almost like wrong is watching, or or it's like just this cosmic experience of like what's like it's seeing objectively, like seeing this whole situation objectively, and it just brings this like this calm. This really simple, like clear, sort of um yeah, it's like that. If you're a cosmic being and you come down and you're on a mission, it kind of it kind of has that tone of just like, oh yeah, all right, cool. Like, what am I really here to do? What's really the point here? So that's I think that's the most useful thing. I love the I love imagining Ventini's like face on these people that that lovingly distract me.

SPEAKER_06 1:30:09

That's him taking out her humanity.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:11

I hear a very I hear a very disorganized mind. I really screamed.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:19

But Tina's supposed to make all of her decisions for her, and so he she has to start making decisions in reality based off of what he would tell her to do with her. Well, just he's the ultimate authority.

SPEAKER_06 1:30:31

Yes, and she's saying, I miss this person, I miss this boyfriend. And her first impulse is to say, I miss you. And Ben says that's that's a distraction, and that's what he does with every fucking person that Corey dates. It's a distraction. At some point it's distracting her from the mission, and he has to hook her back.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:48

That's how he is yeah, he isolates you that way. Um This is just this is just another text that is reminiscent. This is when before me and Jade left, Bentino went to this vow of silence, and um it's pretty reminiscent of actually the one he sent a few years prior to Allison about humanity. So this is just something that I found. Um and he this is his motivating, this is the way he motivates his team.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:12

Um this is he's talking to a group of people here.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:19

His his most devoted followers, like people that have given their life to this, you know.

SPEAKER_06 1:31:24

Paolo wasn't in this group at this time. It was just that like the girlfriend usually isn't in the office chat unless they're bought in, like me and Jacqueline were. And this is a much longer rant, but this is the clip that we're sharing from that.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:35

There's people in this group that um have given like a decade of their life to Bentino already, but this isn't this is how he talks to them. He says, I don't want to have these dialogues any longer. You're either in and you'll create what is needed or you're not. This back and forth is like a lame fucking princess girlfriend, makes it all the more evident to me how nobody is reliable in energy. And the devotion of mankind is weak and feeble and conditional, and nobody sees the truth. Bye for now. This team takes too much effort, should be the opposite way, giving me encouraging evidence and support and nourishment. Y'all princesses, we're the princesses, even though he needs undying nourishment and support. Well, some of you in some ways, others in others, it's all good. Um, this is just an example of the tantrums he throws in the in the cult to, you know, motivate or inspire people to get them to like be more productive and work on whatever it is that he wants them to work on.

SPEAKER_06 1:32:23

And also at that point, we were in Merida, which was like a hundred degrees. It was poor, it was like sweaty hot. We had just done an entire 15-day retreat where people paid $15,000. It was a thousand dollars a day, where Corey's own mom was there, and everyone was like depleted. And that was when I was saying, Hey, I'm vomiting, I need to go home. And he's like, No, your body is a loudspeaker. We're gonna move, we're not gonna stay here. And then he kept us there another month. Now he is in this like nice, beautiful kind of um house with AC with Paola and Corey, and the rest of us were at this like shitty, shoddy, like weird, dilapidated place where like the the AC would fuse would blow and you're just at in your room sweating buckets in the night. Um, so so I'm just saying that because he was keeping us in this hellish place. Now he's saying we're lazy and we're lame when everyone's working but him. We were all the ones that were generating all these things. So it just all of a sudden he pulls a gun out and he's bored and he's like starts shooting in the air and is like, Who's gonna make me stop doing this? You know, and it's like it's shame. This is shame. You're shaming people into moving. Why does that work in that group? Because that's what they use all the time.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:34

Yeah. Okay. And this next last one is just an example of again, kind of like the flying monkeys at play here.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:41

Um, this is after who's talking to cars here?

SPEAKER_02 1:33:44

This is cars to me. Um, and I think this might have been after I made the post or something, or it might have just been after I left the crew. No, I think it was after I made the post, the devil's playground. Um, so this is an example of like the type of text you'll receive when you leave a high control group from other people that are besides the leader, a cult, you know. Um, and these are people that I I had a relationship with cars, you know. Like we're buddies in the cult. Like he was an absolute dick to me sometimes, but still, like, you know, we're trying to build this camaraderie around this mission to help the planet. So, anyways, he says, Hey, bro, something feels off about the way you left the team. I guess you don't really remember what you signed up for when joining this team and group of people. It is the break free from who you think you are. It is the rabbit hole. When you requested to be a part of this in Ecuador, you chose to enter the rabbit hole. Mind you, I was in Ecuador helping another business. They just came in out of nowhere and all of a sudden I was living with cars and all of these cult members. Um, and then eventually they invited me to the party while they had already moved into my house, and I was like, Yeah, sure, I'll go. So he says, How far you want to go in is your choice. You can always get out. Can I? Because I just tried, and this is what I'm getting hit with. The energy I pick up now is how you start to blame Ben and or the crew. Why? Because you can't handle it. Just leave with dignity and respect. Stay loving, meaning keep your mouth shut.

SPEAKER_05 1:35:02

Well, that's what I tried to do. You can't. It's a cult.

SPEAKER_01 1:35:06

That's part four. If you've been with us since the beginning, you'll recognize the patterns in everything you just heard. Even where the specifics change. The negative entity framing. Doubt isn't information, it's an attack, a visit from something dark. We heard it directly in Jaclyn's exit conversation with Corey. Devotion as closeness to God. Corey said it herself. Doubting Ben pulls you away from unity, from him, from truth. Plug the holes, working in real time. Three people contacted within half an hour of each other, the machine kicking in the moment Keelan's post looked like a threat. Triangulation. That pool situation wasn't an accident. Put people in competition with each other, and none of them look at the person who set it up. Isolation. You can't talk to anyone who's left. Staying connected to someone who's out gets treated as contamination. Shame is fuel, the princess rant. Keep people exhausted and guilty enough, and they'll do anything to prove they're not the problem. And underneath all of it, the thing that actually makes this work. Almost nobody in that inner circle thinks they're doing something evil. In her mind, Corey isn't lying to protect a monster. She believes she's protecting someone pure from people who don't understand. That's the same thing you heard from Jaclyn about herself back in episode one. It's the same thing you'll hear from Cars in his text with Keelan. And Brent Wilkins is still with us in all of this. What happened to him is the reminder of what's actually at stake underneath every pattern we just walked through. There's more we recorded that isn't in this episode. I don't know if or when it should or will come out. It is intensely disturbing. And it implicates a lot of other people who let something horrible happen and they looked away. And by the way, this isn't a sales tactic to keep you tuned in. I'm genuinely struggling with whether to put it out. More than anything, I want you to understand these patterns and not just get stuck in the specific story and these specific characters. This same struggle plays out in families, in groups, corporations, charities, NGOs, political parties, entire countries. It's always tempting to think this only happens with the other people, with the enemy, the brainwashed. What if that's not true? What if it's happening in your group too?